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Shradow

Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

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Time to start maining Piranha Plant.

By god there's actual patch notes, I'm so happy. And a short hop shortcut on it's own, that's sick. Cuz you can't use the short hop attack shortcut to do falling short hop attacks.

 

Edited by Shradow

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So, anyone have a TL;DR on what characters got nerfed. Buffs are just as important, but knowing who get hurt is more interesting for me.

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Someone made an infographic:

832bdisq1hd21.png

Context still helps in certain cases, though. For example, Ike's only change is that Aether doesn't spike bounce opponents up when hitting them on the stage, but unlike Chrom dying first during suicide kills, Ike's still kills first when used offstage. K. Rool's nerfs were also quite minor, and one of them was a bury nerf which was done to multiple other characters with buries as well.

Edited by Shradow

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Again, context is important. All they did for Peach/Daisy was reduce the launch distance of their up special. They can still true combo you to 60% from a dtilt or nair and do all the other crazy bullshit.

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That is super helpful. Curious how much of a nerf the bury stuff is since it only mentions undamaged. Since you seem to have a good handle on it, any of the nerfs substantial? 

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I don't play a lot of the characters that had changes but some of the notable stuff that I know of:

Palutena and Mewtwo's teleports grab ledges easier which they sort of needed.

The Puff has been buffed, her bair is scary fast now, among other things.

Mega Man lost pellet canceling, so RIP him.

I also mentioned that Chrom now dies first if he goes for a suicide kill (but not Ike).

Bowser actually got some damage/knockback buffs on some of his moves. :3

Some buffs across multiple characters were just reduced landing lag and reducing the amount of time they can't grab ledges after using certain moves.

Edited by Shradow

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Yea, lag reduction and easier time grabbing the ledge were the most common changes I saw. Nice that they are mostly buffing characters and from what I can tell none of the nerfs seem THAT huge (outside of Megaman's based on what you said).

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Also, to those that haven't seen it, Plant's Palutena's Guidance is pretty great (and this also means DLC characters are getting them, unlike in Smash 4):

 

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Also, something I didn't realize about the patch notes, unless I'm mistaken Luigi's dair no longer spiking on the ground means he can't do his 0 to death combo the same way anymore. So that's good.

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>Mewtwo grabs ledges easier

Fucking thank you. This was desperately needed. 

 

Fast thoughts on piranha plant:

FUCK THIS GIRL IS STRONG. Fantastic aerials, a down b that punishes the entire game, and even her worst move (ptooie) is absolutely fantastic anti-air. Not really my style of character, but still amazingly strong by all means.

Edited by (youknowwhoiam)
piranha plant

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Plant is genderless (like all plants). The game even refers to it using "it." I'll assume your misconception came from the Palutena's Guide (based on seeing many others make the same mistake), but the "she" Palutena said was referring to Viridi, not Plant.

As for how strong it is, I'm feeling mid tier at best, maybe even just a strong low tier. Good ledgetrapping and edgeguarding tools and a couple ways to mix up an otherwise linear (but far-reaching) recovery via stalling with b or down b, it feels good but nothing really stands out, especially as far as combos go (and if you're a heavy that lacks combos you best be hitting like Ganondorf or Bowser, which Plant unfortunately does not). It has a few things at low percents such as dthrow into fair or uair + neutral b chains, but that's about it.

Though down b is easily its worst move. It takes too long to charge, and you maintain your hurtbox during the extend so people can actually just hit or grab you by your face if you miss. It's potentially good for edgeguarding since you can angle it downwards in the air (but also potentially bad since if you extend out your hurtbox and miss, you could easily get spiked or gimped or something in retaliation) and can stall your recovery in the air, but it's primarily a gimmick move. Ptooie can also do a lot of the same utility, but it can do things like guard above you (and then be directed to chase opponents if they try airdodge to the side or something), and hit people more reliably.

I really like the poison cloud even if the big damage is mostly a dream scenario that's sometimes abusable against those who don't know how Plant works yet. Because while you can get a ton of damage potentially, it's not like you can consistently grab someone/keep them in your rapid jabs inside the cloud or anything. It's best use is for zoning and ledgetrapping, such as jumping off the level and putting it at the ledge so people are forced to make a decision and can't just hang, or put it right above the edge meaning they have to either jump from the ledge, roll, or just recovery high instead of going for the ledge at all. The fact it conceals Plant while they're in it is potentially useful, too, and it does mad shield damage so if people are in it for any time at all they pretty much have to accept some damage and get out or risk being grabbed/shield broken. Overall I like it as a utility move.

I'm glad it's heavy, though. 112 weight, above Samus (108) and below Incineroar (116). But it's a sort of weird heavy zoner but it doesn't quite have the pressure of someone like Snake, and isn't the best at approaching either. I wouldn't say their aerials are fantastic, either, just good. Uair and fair sort of take too long to start getting kills, and while bair can kill earlier it's end lag is atrocious, comparitively. Dair's spike hitbox is also quite short and small. Nair's drag down into jab or whatever is pretty dope, though. Utilt and dtilt are pretty nice, but I feel like ftilt is a bit unsafe.

Granted these are all just my thoughts after only a day.

One of my favorite things out of this update is that matches online no longer have you waiting another 30 seconds, it's pretty much instant.

Edited by Shradow

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Well, today I FINALLY managed to win the Pauline spirit.

If anyone's curious:

Spoiler

I used Peach. My spirits were Hero Chao and Halberd. That way, I could build up Smash and sustain more damage. I tried to go after Peach, but of course Donkey Kong and Mario intervened at points. How I beat her was grabbing/touching a clock item that slows down time, then going "Ha-cha!" at Peach until I knocked her out of the screen. It's cheap, but for spirits like this I so don't care.

 

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Um, this should really just be in the smash thread. Merging it into that.

For me, the Geno and Willy stages gave me a ton of grief in my first run. You really need high level legendary spirits of your own to fight them and I had next to nothing and was also doing it on hard. Eventually got there on both though. 

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13 hours ago, Shradow said:

Plant is genderless (like all plants). The game even refers to it using "it." I'll assume your misconception came from the Palutena's Guide (based on seeing many others make the same mistake), but the "she" Palutena said was referring to Viridi, not Plant.

I know. That's the joke.

Although I really don't have the time for this game (hello con season) I'm really enjoying plant as an addition after a few more hours of gameplay. She felt a bit too strong at first, but I think that is because people are still figuring out the counterplay. I can't say I know what that counterplay will be, but it seems she's most vulnerable from directly underneath, since she doesn't have any real landing options beyond using up b to get the fuck away and land somewhere else.

Projectiles also have potential, since there isn't much plant can do beyond the range of the down b. She's got a pretty good approach speed and neutral game though, so this doesn't feel terribly reliable unless you're someone particularly slippery, and that limits kill options quite a lot.

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btw, if anyone wants to add me, my friend code is 5800-7199-8796.

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Well, I got Piranha Plant yesterday. And all can say is it's...okay.

One thing I truly like about the character is the final smash which summons Petey Piranha. A callback to Super Smash Bros. Brawl and by extension Super Mario Sunshine.

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It's really cool seeing all the Melee pros putting so much time into Ultimate and attending tournaments and stuff. At Genesis 6, Leffen (and maybe other big Melee players, I'm not sure) even dropped out of Melee top 64 in favor of Ultimate top 64 because both were running at the same time.

Edited by Shradow

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20 hours ago, Shradow said:

It's really cool seeing all the Melee pros putting so much time into Ultimate and attending tournaments and stuff. At Genesis 6, Leffen (and maybe other big Melee players, I'm not sure) even dropped out of Melee top 64 in favor of Ultimate top 64 because both were running at the same time.

So what you're saying, is that...

Everyone is here

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So from the blurred images from the version 3.0 tease, people are thinking they might be hinting at Stage Builder. That'd be pretty neat to have back, and it alongside Joker would certainly warrant a 3.0 despite how recently we got 2.0.

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Okay hear me out.

The MC from Three Houses.

Pokemon trainer style

Where you can swap between the three leaders of each house.

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Also it's been confirmed that the 5 DLC fighters won't have a Palutena's Guidance. I guess Plant had one because it was one of the things that had already been done for it before release.

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17 minutes ago, Shradow said:

Also it's been confirmed that the 5 DLC fighters won't have a Palutena's Guidance. I guess Plant had one because it was one of the things that had already been done for it before release.

 

The dream of Futaba and/or Morgana joining in on the Guidance has now been crushed. =(

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Does anyone here play Ridley and would be willing to help me practice against him sometime?

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